Software Reality
Programming with
a dose of satire.

Site Map Search


Matt Stephens
 
Use Case Driven
 
Agile Development
 
Extreme Programming
 
Code Generation


Articles
Lifecycle
Design
Programming
Soapbox
Reviews
Cthulhu

Use Case Driven
Use Case Driven Object Modeling with UML: Theory and Practice
Get from use cases to working, maintainable source code. Examples use Spring Framework, JUnit and Enterprise Architect

Agile UML
Agile Development with ICONIX Process
A practical subset of agile development techniques, illustrated by example

Get Controversial!
Extreme Programming Refactored
Extreme Programming with a dose of satire
Available now:






Check out our ageing Reviews Section



T-Shirts etc.

Software Reality T-shirt

Wear a swanky Software Reality T-shirt under your suit, and prove (at least to yourself) that you don't follow the crowd.

Software Reality mug

Or if you're feeling bold, carefully place an official Software Reality mug on your desk!



Soapbox

A Programmer In China - Message Archive

Page 2

<< Back to the story


Message Index


I liked it
Pat Morehouse pmorehouse@hotmail.com

Not a bad article.
dasmb das@NOSPAMPLEASEdasmegabyte.org

FUNNY!!!
anon

Funny
Anonymous

okay, so intelligence is dead
rascal

not racist, just sexist
Brad Brad's house

What a load of trash
George a@a.com

The author is not a racist
Loren no@way.com

Not much of a cheese shop is it?
John Cleese JohnC@yahoo.com

Simple knowledge
Boy Next Door

STOP THE INSANITY
rpin heyitsrod@yahoo.com

we'll fuck you all up fat western bastards!
Ivan vanya@mail.ru

Yawn
Anonymous person

Some of you commentors aren't serious enough
boots

Lucky you're back in 1 piece!!
ccc real@onlyme

When I was in Hong Kong
Not a@p.om

Fuckin idiot.
Fabrizio franchini@alphapoint.it

Nixon should be impeached
wheaties hojo@hotmail.com

Could you say something about your different trips in different countries
Sky Pam pan_sikai@21cn.com

You can't compare a developed country and  a developing country.
Dick Lee dolina3636@yahoo.com

狗屁老外
动力! cmaild@163.com

USA pigggggggggggggggggg! ...
because

I think you are complete wrong!
Realboy

r u westrner?
aldo aldo@aldo.NET

Children children....
Paul

Children children....
Paul

you make a mistake
Alen hello@163.com

You not know whta you talking aboute dude
China Boy chinaboy666@hotmail.com

No sense of personal space?
Loren no@way.com

Eating foetus in Southern China as health food
Nguyen nhutvnguyen@yahoo.com

This guy is stupid really
guest eric@hotmail.com

Compassion? Not to the priviledged.
bodycode no@no.com

YouŽd better stay in your fucking home or just trip to alabama
Luo Wei


The Messages


I liked it
I liked this article. It's different. Most of what we hear about China here in the US is just about the government or the WTO or political tensions. I like to hear what China's really like. Like this article I found the other day:

http://www.capitalistfreepress.com/Articles/00009_xl.htm

It's written by a 16 year old Chinese girl. Pretty interesting. Makes you think about where our country's headed.

I don't want to live in a place like the China that Dino described. If you guys don't either, don't ignore the connections between China's politics (socialism) and the everyday lives of its citizens.

Pat Morehouse pmorehouse@hotmail.com
New Jersey, US

Thu Nov 14 05:21:04 GMT 2002
Not a bad article.
As a fatass in the states, I like to hear stories about what's good AND bad in other countries. I enjoy travelling and don't like hearing "oh, country X is beautiful and the food is exquisite." I travel to see the human condition in an alien environment and to enjoy the hardship and stupidity of other cultures as well as the wonder.

Speaking of which, if you come to New York expect to be bored and annoyed by upstate. It's very empty in places and there's very little to do. Most of our bars and music venues aren't worth speaking of and hotels are generally either very rotten or sterile. Most of our museums aren't worth speaking of and our hiking trails are over travelled. Small cities are often decaying centers of poverty and violence -- examples include Troy, Poughkeepsie and Newburgh. Traffic is sparse except at peak times when it is clogged with huge trucks and SUVs.

But on the plus side, you can get any food you want from across the earth. Our supermarkets and food co-ops are the best and often carry local goods. Some great brew pubs in the area as well as fantastic chicken wings -- and the less traversed areas of the catskills and the Adirondacks are exactly as they were when the rockefellers owned them.

dasmb das@NOSPAMPLEASEdasmegabyte.org
NY, USA

Fri Nov 15 17:23:30 GMT 2002
FUNNY!!!
Well, if anyone doesn't think this is funny, then they should stop taking themselves so seriously. No, I am not racist, and not closed-minded, and yes, I have travelled the world. And yes, I think this is very, very funny.
anon

Sat Nov 16 04:06:57 GMT 2002
Funny
I don't find this article racist in the slightest being chinese myself, it was quite an accurate description of what one would experience in China, I had the same experience when I last visited, especially the comments on toilets a very useful tip.
Anonymous
UK

Mon Nov 18 05:18:41 GMT 2002
okay, so intelligence is dead
Did you people just completely miss the satire which was present in this article?

Funny, it drips from every word.

Just a note.

rascal

Tue Nov 19 04:53:46 GMT 2002
not racist, just sexist
What struck me as wierd was that he was on a trip with his wife and found it so important to analyze the women everywhere. I still liked it.

Brad Brad's house
WISCONSIN, USA

Tue Nov 19 16:53:58 GMT 2002
What a load of trash
Matt - did you *ever* imagine in your wildest nightmare that such a lightweight article could cause such a torrent of abuse?

Some people just have *no* idea of what is important and what is just for fun.

It's also rather disturbing how many contributors seem barely literate (cue: loads of hate mail criticising my grammer(sic))

Sigh.

George a@a.com

Thu Nov 21 16:09:43 GMT 2002
The author is not a racist
I haven't seen as many places in China as the author but I have spent a total of nearly 5 months in Shanghai over the last 4 years. My wife is from there and we go back to visit her family.

Dog isn't popular there but she says it's eaten elsewhere. While such a thing is shocking to us, until recently they haven't regarded dogs as pets. Thus what's the problem with eating them?
They do tend to use a lot of fat in their food but that's a matter of taste. As for grisle--they simply don't trim off the parts that an western chef would have thrown before it ever got to the table. Some people like it (my wife is one such--give her a nice filet and a hunk of grisle and there's no doubt she will go for the grisle.)

Sanitary standards are far below what we are used to, also, although they seem to be improving. In general if you don't drink the tap water and don't eat at the low quality places you're ok although on our last trip we tried a brand new place (by appearances and price it was high quality) that gave both of us some intestinal problems.
Her folks used to live in a place overlooking a canal. The far side had not yet been subject to urban renewal and was occupied by a lot of poor people. I saw a *LOT* of men peeing in the canal but no women. The location has a lot to do with this--I never saw such behavior outside poor areas.

A couple of times I saw small kids peeing into tree holes in the sidewalk with parental aid in otherwise higher class areas. I also noted some small kids wearing clothing with a split such that if they squatted it would open enough to permit a bowel movement--wiping would be a problem, though! I have never seen them actually using this feature, though.

While the voices are loud, every internet cafe I have been in had headphones instead of speakers.

As for the traffic, I don't think the author was quite correct. The basic rule of the road seems to be that you can do anything you want so long as you do not *FORCE* an accident. Making the other guy stand on his brakes is fine, though. The behavior is very different if there should happen to be a cop around, though!
They do seem to yield to pedestrians, although they will try to go around rather than stop.
I have not observed any particular affinity for lane stradding in most cases. However, a lone car on the road (a rare occurence) probably drives in the exact center. Furthermore, should the road be laid out with two wide lanes it will normally have 3 actual lanes--and the middle car thus straddles.
Accident statistics bear out the fact that their traffic is wild. They have far fewer cars than the US but more than twice the number of traffic deaths.

I've had no problems with pickpockets, but I am aware that a tourist is a target anywhere--I wouldn't think of carrying a wallet.

Pointing out reality is not being racist. Different tastes are not wrong tastes.

Besides, by third-world standards, China is actually quite good. I've been in many countries (admittedly more than a decade before China) and any complaint you have about China is far worse elsewhere.

Loren no@way.com
Nevada, USA

Tue Nov 26 01:23:41 GMT 2002
Not much of a cheese shop is it?
Yes. I was just reading what you all have said about that British fellow who happened to take a trip to China. Well, I don't see anything about Chinese cheese. They must make cheese in China?
I would like to go there just to sample the wonderful cheeses that could come from a country with 1.3 billion people. I don't care how fucking runny it is, hand it over with all speed.

John.

John Cleese JohnC@yahoo.com
Yorkshire, UK

Sun Dec 01 07:23:40 GMT 2002
Simple knowledge
Just to remind u all. <b>There always be good people and bad people every where</b>. Whether u can understand this statement or not, u are a living evidance of this statement.
Boy Next Door
Indonesia, e=mc^2

Mon Dec 02 20:05:55 GMT 2002
STOP THE INSANITY
I can't belive that this article have generated so much controversy.

I want to add my 2 cents to this issue.

1. I assume by the web site context ( Computer porgramming ) and the style of writing that this article is a practical opinion piece. This means he is not trying to prove his point with statistical or scientifist or genetic data. He is only expressing his opinion.

2. We are in the USA where we are governed by laws. Some of these laws are in our constitution and expresely warrants the rigths to express an opinion.

3. Other countries have been known to not upheld the same principles of freedom of choice and freedom of speach that we hold dear.

Based on these premises I would believe that Mr. Fancellu was expressing his personal view and opinions (factuals or not ) of his trip to china. I found very his writing style very informal , interesting and witha a touch of fiction , Never the less IS HIS OPINION.

I have not been in China although I have read and watch countless documentals and opinion of the cultural, political , economical, social and historical issues of China.

I find his opinion getting very close to what my perception of this Country is.

In reference to the many opinions expressed to mr. Fanucelli articles, I would say that I am sad by the actitute of many to use MEDIEVAL and TOTALITARIAN techniques of attacking the character of the person not the IDEAS. If you dont believe what he said, express your opinion of what you think is true, start a factual debate with the goal of probing your point or believes.

The moment you start offending and attacking his person ( IN THIS COUNTRY AT LEAST ) you were defeated, you fell to the lowest category a human being can be. That moment you became CULTURAL INSENSITIVE and racist to my culture.

I conclude with the hopes that many of you see my point and elevate yourselft to the only choice that can bring your out of the cave of ignorance and racism.

Rod

rpin heyitsrod@yahoo.com
ON, Canada

Mon Dec 02 21:51:21 GMT 2002
we'll fuck you all up fat western bastards!
USA, of course. A nation of idiotic freaks with fat instead of the brain. Should be wiped out completely. Just remember - no American should ever step his foot on your land and walk alive! Brother muslims! Let's stop fighting each other and focus on the one truly evil enemy - the Western civilization! Kill Americans! Slaughter them all! No mercy! Slaughter everyone - men, women, children - they are all damned from the birth. Blow up their airplanes, their buses, their buildings, poison them... nuke them dammit! You know, we should've sold some nukes to Saddam long, long ago... Only when the last one of their breed is dead, will us humans (and not the animals walking on two legs) live freely.


Ivan vanya@mail.ru
Russia

Mon Dec 02 22:17:44 GMT 2002
Yawn
What a tard "Ivan" is.

Yes, we should all kill each other.

Race/Country X should be destroyed.
God/Allah/Yaweh/Budda is great,
but a bit busy at the moment, so let's
kill in his name!

Now, that's better.

Only the internet can bring this kind of idiot to your door 24/7.

I'm sure he typed that email one handed, whilst his little 'punisher' spewed forth over his keyboard.

There's nothing quite like a little man with a gun in his hand, picking innocents to slay in the hope it'll make him bigger.

Anonymous person

Mon Dec 02 23:11:24 GMT 2002
Some of you commentors aren't serious enough
To add to your seriousness, try dropping dead.

How can you read this guys travel log and conclude that he is a racist? Perhaps google isn't properly translating this document into your native languages because it is obvious that you don't understand english inuendo or sarcasm.

For the person with the English writing lesson: what do you know?? If I read this guys article and he says that girls in a certain place are ugly--am I supposed to assume that because he didn't say "he thinks" that he is actually an authority on the subject? Get a grip--EVERYTHING on the internet is an opinion. If you don't understand that, then let me say: "You are a true idiot." By-the-way, that's not my opinion--that's fact ;)

Nice travel log, my man. Well, entertaining for sure!!

boots

Tue Dec 03 00:05:32 GMT 2002
Lucky you're back in 1 piece!!
They SHOULD have eaten you alive in China!!!
ccc real@onlyme
Hong Kong, China

Tue Dec 03 09:14:36 GMT 2002
When I was in Hong Kong
I thought the girls looked amazing!

It's actually one of the coolest places I've ever been to.

If I was from the UK I wouldn't badmouth any country's girls OR food... glass house, rocks ?

Not a@p.om
Israel

Tue Dec 03 10:44:21 GMT 2002
Fuckin idiot.
Suck my dick!
Fabrizio franchini@alphapoint.it
Italy, Italy

Tue Dec 03 14:38:41 GMT 2002
Nixon should be impeached
Thought Dino's comments were honest & humor-filled. Have had the displeasure of milling around Chinese grad students. Some were ok, but most cheated as though THAT were ok and their 2nd nature. Also, no sense of personal space...but can forgive that since they have 1 1/2 billion folks...shoving can't be avoided. Anyway, I'd like to dig up Nixon's bones and make dice out of 'em for opening up markets with them. Now we're in bed with these commies and 3/4 of what we have here is made...there. And what Tricky Dick started, Slick Willy finished. Can you say "USA is China's whore"? Thanks Dino...you go man.
wheaties hojo@hotmail.com
US

Wed Dec 04 00:40:48 GMT 2002
Could you say something about your different trips in different countries so that we could have a good reference?
somewhere you are right,somewhere you are wrong.After all you are from the UK,it's impossible to understand China very well in a short time.You said you have married a chinese wife,why not to learn more about china?like politics,economy,culture.One day you will find many interesting things are attracting you.
Could you say something about your different trips in different countries so that we could have a good reference?

Sky Pam pan_sikai@21cn.com
Zhejiang, China

Thu Dec 05 00:25:16 GMT 2002
You can't compare a developed country and
a developing country. China is having a
boom in everything. What don't you
compare Swizerland with Bangledesh or
Kenya.

Dick Lee dolina3636@yahoo.com
Hong Kong

Fri Dec 06 03:14:49 GMT 2002
狗屁老外
~!!!!!!!!!!!!1
动力! cmaild@163.com
jinzou , 中国

Fri Dec 06 04:08:21 GMT 2002
USA pigggggggggggggggggg!
because
china

Fri Dec 06 08:39:54 GMT 2002
I think you are complete wrong!
I think China is a great country,which have a long history and ancient culture.
But you only see and comment on the weakness about China.
Everything in China is same as in English,that's impossible.
In these years,China are changing with each passing day.
China will be stronger and stronger.
But I am not interested in rating English.
Let's give attention to the future.

Realboy

Fri Dec 06 09:46:57 GMT 2002
r u westrner?
"one guy with a waist 9 inches across. "

Are you okay? This is what you think strange??
you should from a village? stupid guy! come to have a look at Austrlia or any other big cities arround the world!

you just consider that remarkable simply because one has not seen it before.

aldo aldo@aldo.NET
CHINA, CHINA

Fri Dec 06 16:27:24 GMT 2002
Children children....
I don't see what all the fuss is about. The artcile is obviously full of sarcasm and humour. It is the authors opinion and he/she is entitled to it. Just like all you ranters are too.

If this article upsets you so much then ignore it. Posting flames messages just makes things worse. Grow up, this is supposed to be a big boys site.

As for the author, did you actually enjoy the trip? Even though there were lots you found strange and didnt like surely you enjoyed many aspects. From the looks of it you tasted almost every type of food going while you were there! :D

Paul
UK

Mon Dec 09 04:54:19 GMT 2002
Children children....
I don't see what all the fuss is about. The artcile is obviously full of sarcasm and humour. It is the authors opinion and he/she is entitled to it. Just like all you ranters are too.

If this article upsets you so much then ignore it. Posting flames messages just makes things worse. Grow up, this is supposed to be a big boys site.

As for the author, did you actually enjoy the trip? Even though there were lots you found strange and didnt like surely you enjoyed many aspects. From the looks of it you tasted almost every type of food going while you were there! :D

Paul
UK

Mon Dec 09 04:55:18 GMT 2002
you make a mistake
china is a very good contry , you make a mistake .
Alen hello@163.com
japan

Thu Dec 12 08:02:03 GMT 2002
You not know whta you talking aboute dude
You'r very stupid to talk about Hk girls in such a manner. You very bad.you not no any thing. No wondre you'r country and the people are at end of you'r glorey. China rises. and one day you and you'r people will be subjects of our glorius country. Hongkong is much better today without you and ugly Ukay presents.

Good-buy to you.

China Boy chinaboy666@hotmail.com
hKong, PRC

Thu Dec 12 21:42:26 GMT 2002
No sense of personal space?
It's not that they have no sense of personal space. It's that their standard of how much personal space one needs is less than our standard. China isn't the only country like this, different cultures have different standards of how much space is proper. Anyone from a country with a higher standard will tend to feel intruded upon by those from a country with a lower standard.
This is in no way a good or bad thing, merely a conflict caused by a difference.

Loren no@way.com
Las Vegas, USA

Thu Dec 19 02:50:43 GMT 2002
Eating foetus in Southern China as health food
Hi,

I read and saw some photographs of a man eating human foetus in China, as well as some photographs describing the preparation of a bowl of soup with a baby foetus inside. Is that true or they just made it up ?

Anyone knows about the authenticity of the news, please tell me. Thanks.

Nguyen.

Nguyen nhutvnguyen@yahoo.com
Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam

Mon Mar 31 12:03:46 GMT 2003
This guy is stupid really
I don't know when this stupid programmer go to China. it's just trying to uglify China, make more people misleading. that's it. just go there and have a look. also, it's a damn to have a space for this kind of article in this site...
guest eric@hotmail.com
Toronto, Canada

Wed Apr 02 00:37:15 GMT 2003
Compassion? Not to the priviledged.
When you're a US born and bred International traveller, you realize how lucky you are. I've been all over. And believe me when I tell you, more than 85% of the planet's in a bacterially infected gutter. The world's a dangerious, smelly, violent, poor, hungry, fetic disgusting place. So be kind, keep your eyes and your ears open, and, last but not least, your heart. OK?
bodycode no@no.com
Queens, NY, US of A

Fri Apr 04 07:47:05 GMT 2003
YouŽd better stay in your fucking home or just trip to alabama
YouŽd better stay in your fucking home or just trip to alabama, thatŽs the best you deserve, bastard.

IŽm a european guy in shanghai for nine months now. The first i knew was that this was going to be different, what did you expect, bitch, something similar to the pub in your fucking town?.

Luo Wei
Shanghai, China

Tue May 06 05:01:49 GMT 2003


<< Back to the story

<< Back to Soapbox

All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective owners.
Stories and articles are owned by the original author.
All the rest Copyright © 1998 onwards Matt Stephens. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.